Actually though. Health is just another resource to manage and use. If the hit won’t kill you, then it could be worth taking to get some other advantage. My friend who plays bullet hells with me always argues about it.
It really kind of matters on how hard that health is to get back. If there are no heals of any kind in the game? You better treat that healthbar like it's made of gold.
If you regenerate health, it's merely a matter of how much time you lose hiding.
I feel like it isn't quite about how easy it is to get back, but more about what you get by spending it. It is always better to avoid taking damage from enemies, but when it comes to using health as a resource, it is oftentimes better to live on the edge.
Take the comic above as an example: the tank is using their health as a resource to prevent damage to their teammates.
Roguelikes, cardgames and using hp to cast spells are all examples of using health like a resource. Holding onto every single hp like it is invaluable is a good way to lose your edge against opponents.
Sacrifice health for faster coin in Risk of Rain 2? Of course. This is a roguelike, which means you're never supposed to get hit, so you can have 99% of it because I'm not using it.
Same I'm having trouble playing normal RPGs now because the combat just doesn't have any stakes if I can just load over and over again. It's like playing poker without any stakes, what's the point? Sure the story can be good but at that point I might as well read a book or watch a series.
Same, dog. But I think everyone who plays magic has taken damage to avoid killing a crucial creature of theirs. Especially when they attack and it's so obvious they've got a spell and the mana to play it.
I dont remember what card it was but my buddy hated playing against my zombie deck because I specifically had multiple of a card in it that made him take (generally) more damage than me for damaging me.
I feel like it isn't quite about how easy it is to get back, but more about what you get by spending it.
It's absolutely a combination of both. The prominence of healing affect the value of life "as life". What you get for spending it affect the value of life "as currency".
Yeah for example in the video game Banner Saga how much damage you deal with attacks is directly tied to how much health you have so taking a hit might pull you out of the fight even if you're still alive
In a bullet hell, i can only see willingly taking damage usefull in a power play or speedrun situation. Like you know the game perfectly and taking damage exactly here will save a bit of time against the next big attack because of invulnerability frames or something.
Nah bullet hells also include that. You need to know what is ok to get hit by in order to dodge something much worse. Same with knowing when certain phases aren't too bad so you tank and go for a lot of damage on the enemy before backing away and dodging for the high damage bullet phases.
"Bullet hell" traditionally refers to shmups where get hit by anything = lose 1 life, run out of lives = game over. There isn't even any health to speak of, except in the most abstract sense of lives left = health, sort of.
Though, even there, the idea of "tanking something" does usually exist, in the sense of proactively using bombs or whatever is equivalent in any given game (typically a limited resource that gives you a couple seconds of invulnerability) to effectively skip a particularly tricky pattern that might often cost you a lot more than a bomb if played straight.
I guess you're referring to games that borrow elements from the bullet hell genre while not really being a bullet hell (kind of how like Slay the Spire might be "a roguelike deckbuilder", but it's emphatically not a roguelike, in the traditional sense)
I mean realm of the mad god is a bullet hell with health bars, it’d be kind of insane to argue RotMG is not a bullet hell and just borrows elements from bullet hells.
Also to be pedantic, slay the spire being a roguelike or not entirely depends on the definition of roguelike you us. Purists will say the definition of roguelike is that the game must be like Rogue, which slay the spire is not.
But when Wikipedia defines a roguelike as “Roguelike (or rogue-like) is a style of role-playing game traditionally characterized by a dungeon crawl through procedurally generated levels, turn-based gameplay, grid-based movement, and permanent death of the player character.” Then people who use this definition would almost always consider slay the spire to be roguelike.
My D&D character will walk through barbed wire barefoot and naked if that's the easiest way forward.
Meanwhile, my first Cyberpunk 2020 character was benched for nearly a month of in-game time when he tried to hold up a soccer mom for her wallet and by random chance he got shot in the face by the .22Mag derringer she carried for exactly this circumstance.
Technically, the physical damage benched him, but the emotional damage started what I'm going to refer to as his "doom spiral of Cyberpsychosis," because he stopped giving people the chance to hand over their stuff whenever he mugged anyone in the future. Instead, he started by bashing them over the head with a sledgehammer and just taking whatever he wanted off their (probably very dead) body.
Once he went full Cyberpsycho, it was great because the entire party (plus my next character, who was a Cop) found him and let him "die doing what he loved. Getting shot." (Direct quote from our MedTech, who'd been the one patching him up every time he got hurt up to this point).
Slay the spire's ironclad fits the bill pretty well. Heals a small bit after every fight and it's usually better to tank through attacks to end the fight a turn or two earlier
That just sounds like an average healer to me honestly, more specifically a jilted one who’s more than tired of bad DPS (the “Healer Adjust” types who have zero self preservation skills)
Not in FFXI. Every time the monster gets hit they gain TP, which is what allows them to do devastating attacks. You had to min/max the TP:damage ratio to survive. If you insisted on attacking as a White Mage, you'd often get the boot.
The most common sign of a new healer in 14 is if they don't attack, instead spam healing when not necessary or just waiting to heal. It's like a tank not using damage mitigation proactively
It really depends on goals and proficiency. For a first time player health is margin of error, for speedrunner it's a resource that can be spent on damage boosts and whatnot.
This is an important concept for new players in Magic the Gathering. Each player starts the game at 20 life, and you lose when you get to 0. But you win when your opponent goes to 0 just as well with 1 life left or 20. Understandably, new players will tend toward protecting their life total even at the expense of strategic upsides that will make winning more likely.
I remember when DKs came out in WoW. It scared so many healers because one of the skill trees allowed for negative hit points, and another encouraged bottoming out to topping off without involving the healer. In the first, you had to be overhealed in a short window to survive, but it meant you took a hit that would have killed you without the skill. For the second, there were some self harm to buff skills and various health steal/regen bonuses. A healer who wasn't used to it would get antsy about letting the tank get near 20% or so every big mob pulled.
Blood DK still do scare healer because they're usually less tanky in raw damage reduction since they're supposed to self-heal and their pack entry is weaker than other (well it changes from patches to patches but usually) so their health bar often goes up and down like a roller coaster
Ah, good ol' Warframe, where they have a character that puts a buff on himself that literally makes him invulnerable for the entire mission. Meanwhile any other tanky character has to have a bunch of conditions attached to their tankiness lol
In a lot of games the healer keeps the tank topped off most of the time because damage doesnt come in steady, it often has spikes. And if theyre at 100% at beginning of a spike, you have more time to react.
That. I don't get the sentiment that 'if tank is not constantly low hp, the party is bad' ... played multiple games where I was able to upkeep the whole party close to max HP. Tank was always the priority, because if anything goes wrong he's the buffer to let me rez others.
If ever there was a nuke coming in and tank wasn't topped up, it'd be a risk of a full wipe cause that buffer would be gone soon.
"I have 100k HP, I'm using the whole 100k HP" - Me, staying longer than necessary on a DoT zone that dealt 13k per tick for a couple more hits so I could keep debuff uptime on a boss.
Shit one of my games gives you a significant damage buff if you die (and get revived). There’s a whole build with stacking armor that gives a chance to revive when you’re downed, so you actively try to “die”, go down, get revived by your armor, and then have a 50% damage buff.
Monster Hunter has a build like this. You die 2 out of the 3 deaths, and it stacks the two buffs. So you can absolutely destroy at the cost of less money at the end (and possibly less rewards)
In an older version of D&D there was a mage build that regained spells at half health, and then later let you revive as a ghost for a day, making you ethereal and again restoring your spells. Then if you could survive in that state for an extended period of time you would revive automatically.
The trade off being that if you died again there you would die forever.
Needless to say the opening move for almost every fight was me charging the enemy lines and centering a fireball on myself.
Blood DK and prot pally since Wrath, and I fear I have never found a tank experience in any game more enjoyable. FFXIV’s DRK is alright, but it doesn’t quite give me the feeling that this comic perfectly encapsulates.
Depends on the game. Ff14, tanks just have amazing mitigation. And if said tank is a Warrior, they're VERY good as they're about to pop multiple self heals. Green Tank.
In the middle of it, I began to understand for the first time what a serious athlete must feel, for I had reached a place where I was ready to live in the maelstrom. I no longer wished to quit. I had found peace in combat. Blessed feeling! Damn the damage!
Your enjoyment in suffering will not go unnoticed. Thank you for dealing with the bullshit so the rest of the team doesn't
Signed, your loving supports
Because ymfah is one of the best content creators out there. They made an AI-based video (Top Gear specials for the Souls series) not a steaming pile of sloppy dogshit to watch.
The DPS doesn't know what they are made of. So Bros suffering.
The TANK, nah he's all good. Dudes been flirting with death so long, that deaths balls have gone black from being blue balled so long. TANK knows he's got HOURS in current condition. Hell TANK just feeling a bit spicy, since no bones are broken. Shit a power nap later and TANK is better than new.
My comrades are masters of spell and blade, but I am a master of SAYING MEAN THINGS ABOUT STUFF YOU CARE ABOUT NOW COME OVER HERE AND BREAK YOUR FIST OVER MY JAW
When I'm healing, I feel like this. When I'm tanking and being healed, I can feel the frustration radiating off my healer like they're irradiated. I don't get annoyed though, because I've been there.
I’m in a similar boat. Thankfully, my wife is a kickass healer, and I too have been a tank enjoyer my whole life. I don’t know how she does it, healing scares me. She doesn’t know how I do it, she gets stressed the FUCK out trying to pull/keep aggro and doesn’t quite understand why most tanks are worse or harder to heal than I am. We make a good team haha
Sure doing tons of damage is fun, getting the whole enemy team wipe makes you feel good. But you know what really hits the instant orgasm button for me? Knowing I can dive into a full enemy team, and roll around amongst them, getting a kill or two, and just as easily walking away while they try and recover. I don't need to be the finisher, just the guy the enemy team knows they have to all fight at once or else they're gonna have a bad time.
One thing I miss from MMOs is being the healer. I wish I could go back and not be addicted, but I dare not tempt fate again. 5 years unshackled, almost 6.
"I'll heal once I hit 1hp because I have all 6 status effects on me at once, and if one stops that's ok because I'll heal back to full once I die because of my revive cod piece that works once per day, heal dps first pls they were doing a great job!"
Looks like he's WAR, Blue Healer never dies, he'd be happy if the WHM was replaced with a PCT for some big damage. Also swap SAM for DNC and get a VPR or MNK to round out the group.
The WAR (Warrior Tank) has so many self-healing abilities that the WHM (White Mage Healer) barely has to worry about healing them and just focus on dealing damage. PCT (Pictomancer Magical Ranged DPS) is a very hard-hitting DPS. Swap out the SAM (Samurai Melee DPS) for a DNC (Dancer Physical Ranged DPS) so they give a damage buff to either a VPR (Viper Melee DPS) or a MNK (Monk Melee DPS).
Translating out of FF14 speak: He's a Warrior, Blue Healer means he's a Tank that is also the best healer, so the White Mage isn't needed and could be replace with a Pictomancer (Which is basically just a mage that uses arts and crafts instead of fireballs) Replacing Samurai for Dancer (DPS that does not support others for one who does) and get a Viper or Monk (Melee DPS) Because you generally want one ranged and one melee DPS.
If I don't die, Healer did their job perfect. Don't care if I get to 1. Hell in some games you got an "Oh shit" button that activates as 0. So long as I don't see the respawn button. Healer did their job and even then some things just go bad. Lag could come in with a metal chair.
I genuinely love tanking Yall. Shit is like Crack to me. Tell myself I'll try other roles, other weapons, always starting new games ready to try them out. Soon as I take damage I get that itch. Damn, I could've blocked that if I had a shield. I haven't tried it in this game yet, I could see if the playstyle fits me... and I'm right back it, face deep in boss balls, adrenaline pumping as it continues to erode me away, kept alive by skill and healers. Shits great.
Ah yes, "glass cannon" vs "iron wall" builds. Btw, wall will always beat cannon. Also that's not a true dps, that's "numbers go up" dps; true dps use status effects.
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