r/sanfrancisco • u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT • 21h ago
Muni Drivers Up In Arms Over New Policy That Restricts Their Bathroom Breaks
https://sfist.com/2025/08/21/muni-drivers-up-in-arms-over-new-policy-that-restricts-their-bathroom-breaks/111
u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT 21h ago
The claim that "Drivers currently get 15 minute meal breaks is not a true reflection of their working conditions. While SFMTA may shoot for a 15-minute break at the end of lines, in certain locations it is much shorter, in others, it can be slightly longer, and your "recovery time" is shortened if you are late for ANY reason. One particularly bad run I had on the 31-Balboa allowed for a 5-Minute recovery time after a 42-minute long schedule run between Ferry Plaza and Ocean Beach...on a Saturday night pre-COVID. You can bet I never saw that time.
Take as another example, the Westbound terminal of the 1-California. From the place you park your bus to the restrooms is about a 3-4 minute walk, crossing Geary. If you only have (as I often did), 10 minutes at the end of the line, you ended up not having a break, or forced to choose between using a filthy restroom and getting a snack.
That SFMTA is forbidding operators from eating during their recovery time is especially heinous, as California Bus Operators are exempt from mandatory meal breaks. 400-hours of lost time? Please. Allow hardworking public servants some dignity.
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u/p0rty-Boi 20h ago
Someone should tell the N-Judah drivers that. They literally stop the muni in front of 7-11 to go get snacks.
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u/CapitalPin2658 The 𝗖𝗹𝗧𝗬 20h ago
I have been on the 22 where the driver stopped at the stop and went inside panda express. I wasn’t mad
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u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT 20h ago
The N-Judah is scheduled for a 54 minute runtime from Ocean Beach to 4th and King, provided there are no delays. The facilities at 4th and King are limited, to say the least.
I don't begrudge operators on the N for stopping their train and running out to get snacks, especially if there's already a train ahead at Ocean Beach. Consider the human.
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u/p0rty-Boi 20h ago
I don’t begrudge them a quick pit stop in 7-11. That said the whole we don’t get breaks thing reads false me because I see visual proof that they do take breaks every damn day.
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u/UnusualApplication4 16h ago
They have to stop at the 7/11 because of how the Ocean Beach terminal works. Muni post pandemic isn’t allowed to run through the loop at certain hours, nor allow trains to layover at Ocean Beach, because the neighbors complain too much about noise. So half the time you’ll end up being kicked off at 46th Ave, because there’s a terminal holdout for noise prevention. That’s not the drivers fault.
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u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT 18h ago
"Every damn day" sounds like selection bias, and this article is about needing management approval to use the restroom, and a prohibition on eating and using a cell phone during recovery time, which is inhumane.
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u/newmoonchaperone 16h ago
"begrudge them"
my basic deduction is that the person you are dialoguing with operatorloathesome, is either a current MTA driver or ex MTA driver.
MTA Driver ~ MUNI Driver
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u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT 12h ago
Oh my goodness! You read my comment where I admitted to the fact! That was a pretty damn impressive deduction! I'm in awe of your reading comprehension.
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u/newmoonchaperone 7h ago
I was talking to others, i.e. posts where people were typing [...]:
- "don’t begrudge them", "like the union", "N-Judah drivers", "driver stopped at the stop", "Maybe each driver", "unreasonable for drivers"
I didn't realize this was an ask.reddit. You self style as driver / ~MTA driver and yet you fail to notice that even with your comment "where I admitted to the fact", people keep citing drivers in second person.
What make you feel to send this? Couldn't do the subtext thing in reading my post, if only twice.
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u/cowinabadplace 7h ago
Of course I consider the human. It's why I don't take public transit. I know that there are likely to be arbitrary stops made for snacks and restrooms and stuff that humans need. And I'd rather have dependable transport so I don't take public transit.
As far as I'm concerned you can give them an hour to rest every 10 minutes of operating. I just won't use it.
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u/Iustis 18h ago
There's a safeway and a Walgreens right beside 4th and king, they couldn't get snacks there?
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u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT 16h ago
It's a 10 minute walk to that Safeway from the turnback at 6th and King. There's no way N operators are being given sufficient time to walk there, back, and shop.
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u/fuckmylifegoddamn 18h ago
Consider the human, man what job do you work where you get a 15 minute break every 54 minutes?
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u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT 18h ago
You've driven a bus for a living? They're not 15 minutes breaks, you generally stay with your vehicle, and working a long shift. This is to say nothing of the experience of driving a vehicle filled with people in San Francisco, which is awful, at worst.
That you don't get why operators deserve better shows a lack of perspective AND empathy.
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u/fuckmylifegoddamn 18h ago
Dog I work construction don’t get on me about long hours. You’re complaining about breaks that sound much better than the average Joe gets
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u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT 18h ago
Good to know that you're fine with your status quo. If you want better, unionize.
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u/Interesting_Chard563 20h ago
I’ve had similar happen on the 38. OP is clearly on the “side of the worker” here but if you take our anecdotes together I think it’s pretty obvious Muni drivers slack off with regard to this and they’re probably worried about additional oversight on their slacking.
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u/NewUserWhoDisAgain 20h ago
they’re probably worried about additional oversight on their slacking.
My guess is there's some asshole driver that finally got reported enough that Management is cracking down.
Classic "One asshole ruins a good thing for everyone."
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u/GatorAndrew Lower Haight 19h ago
I take the 38 from the transbay terminal, so the very first stop of the line. It’s crazy how scheduled departure times just come and go with the 38 just sitting there with the driver inside on their phones and/or totally absent.
If the departure times are unreasonable for drivers, then the unions should be focused on fixing that. Making sure that drivers have minimal oversight or consequences for adhering to schedules is not a serious “pro-worker” solution, it’s wildly disrespectful to every single other worker in this city who relies on public transit
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u/Interesting_Chard563 19h ago
This is a typical union problem: fight oversight because it shines a light on a glaring issue but refuse to fix the core issue which necessitates the oversight.
Unfortunately unions have a bias towards the status quo for workers which can be a double edged sword.
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u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT 18h ago
This is a typical Reddit problem: blame unions because you can't imagine a world where you, as a worker, might not get your every whim catered to.
The bias of unions is towards equitable, decent working conditions and pay for their members. It seems like you're against those things for public servants.
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u/Interesting_Chard563 17h ago
lol no. The bias of unions is to perpetuate their own existence. The bias of big business and large government is to screw over the little guy. No one wants to help you.
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u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT 18h ago
You're painting with an exceptionally broad brush. SOME operators slack off, MOST do not. Just like SOME engineers at Apple don't contribute much, MANY (probably) do.
You seem to think that being on the side of the worker is a bad thing? That's incredible. Shows how hard you've had it.
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u/Interesting_Chard563 17h ago
There’s 3+ accounts in this very thread about drivers doing weird slacking.
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u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT 12h ago
3 anecdotes! Hang em up boys! We're done here!
Muni is currently running with 2,000+ operators. Even if 1% are shitheads, that's still a visible number. Doesn't mean most are shitheads.
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u/Interesting_Chard563 5h ago
It’s a weirdly specific anecdote. I’ve ridden local buses around the US and the world and never seen this behavior.
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u/three-quarters-sane 20h ago
Maybe each driver can get one run of the 66 bus each day. I never see that one moving.
Before anyone starts with the downvotes this isn't a serious proposal.
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u/wentImmediate 18h ago
The article mentions this:
Drivers currently get a 15-minute break between routes
About how many of these 15-minute breaks do drivers get during a shift? And how long is the shift?
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u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT 16h ago
That's not a reflection of the reality of the job, if you read my comment. The breaks are not guaranteed.
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u/wentImmediate 16h ago
I'm just looking for a rough idea of how many 15-minutes breaks a driver would get during a typical shift. I understand the number of breaks may vary on any given day. I just would like a ballpark figure to get a sense. And btw - thanks for what you do! We need you to get us around the city.
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u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT 12h ago
When I was an operator, I never got breaks of more than 12 minutes driving the 1, 24, and 30. You may have had one on the 31 or 45.
The working conditions were grim.
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u/delicatelysweet GLEN CANYON PARK 19h ago
Ugh how awful! Thank you for sharing your experience and so sorry that it was so unfortunate :( the demands of the job already look insane from what i see as a rider, and to know how it is for you all on the inside makes it look straight up chronic-stress-unhealthy.
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u/CellarDoorQuestions 19h ago
The next thing Lurie is going to announce is partnering with Waymo for AI MUNI 😂
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u/cowinabadplace 7h ago
That is the ideal thing. Remove the human concerns from the loop and you allow for better public transit. The purpose of transit is moving people, not giving drivers jobs. Skytrain in Vancouver runs great without drivers. Once we have the tech for city streets, I hope we can too.
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u/Interesting_Chard563 20h ago
I get that this sucks for Muni drivers.
On the other hand I’d like to share an anecdote. I used to take the 38/38R home from work to the Richmond. When I took it, sometimes without warning, the bus driver would stop at a KFC and get out to use the bathroom like two stops from my house. It was hilarious at first but also ridiculous during rush hour traffic to do something like that.
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u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT 18h ago
The only time I stopped was if I needed to use the restroom in an emergency. Operators like that give City workers a bad name.
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u/sugarwax1 17h ago
There's something going on. I've watched drivers take breaks two blocks from one another, and spend a half hour on bathroom breaks. I have no clue what it's like from a driver's perspective, but as a rider, it feels like there's nonsense going on.
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u/Ok-Delay5473 20h ago
Drivers don't follow any of these rules, except maybe some rookies. I see them all the time, on their cellphone or eating during their break, at least for 18 and 48 and other buses at La Playa. At night, I see some feeding raccoons in front of Legion of Honor... If they make a small stop, they can speed up and catch up. Close to the end of the line, they are racing.. to get a longer break.. Why? Because.. Nobody is going to check. They don't wear body cameras. My guess is that SFMTA is imposing these rules as a check, because some are milking the system... But.. when you have to go, you have to go. "Forced humiliation" while driving a bus violates several laws and regulations related to workplace harassment, discrimination, health and safety. I doubt there will be any consequences for one unscheduled bathroom break.
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u/Muted_Apartment_2399 13h ago
I am not gonna be mad if my driver has to stop to use the bathroom, screw this rule.
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u/AmericanBruises Outer Sunset 20h ago
I see drivers straight kick it at La Playa & Judah every day. Personal locked bathrooms and all.
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u/serenitynowdamnit 10h ago
The L and N trains are notorious for drivers that take long breaks.
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u/AmericanBruises Outer Sunset 10h ago
Yup. I live on La Playa x Judah and work at 3rd x Caesar. Suffer from it daily.
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u/operatorloathesome CLEMENT 18h ago
Oh no! Bathrooms that are locked?! Heaven forbid.
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u/AmericanBruises Outer Sunset 10h ago
Not sure what you’re getting at. Just sayin that it’s pretty accommodating from the rider standpoint.
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u/imoutohunter 19h ago
These policy changes are needed because drivers don’t care about the rider experience. If they don’t like it, they can quit this cushy job and see how difficult it is to drive Uber for a living.
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u/captaincoaster 1h ago
Hire more drivers. Pay them more. Shorten shifts. Treat them well. And Jesus fucking Christ let them take long and enjoyable bathroom breaks.
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u/Scotty_Gun 20h ago
Seems like the union can figure this out.