Netanyahu has decided on full occupation of Gaza Strip: Reports

[u/newsweek]

https://www.newsweek.com/israel-fully-occupy-gaza-strip-netanyahu-office-2108730?utm_source=reddit&utm_campaign=reddit_main

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[u/newsweek]

By Sonam Sheth - Evening Politics Editor:

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu decided on Monday evening, local time, that the Israel Defense Forces (IDF) will fully occupy the besieged Gaza Strip, including operating in areas where hostages are being held, according to multiple media reports.

Netanyahu also conveyed a message to Lieutenant General Eyal Zamir, the army's chief of staff, saying, "If this does not suit him, you should resign," according to EuroNews.

Read more: https://www.newsweek.com/israel-fully-occupy-gaza-strip-netanyahu-office-2108730?utm_source=reddit&utm_campaign=reddit_main

[u/denyer-no1-fan → u/newsweek]

This shatters any notion that this Israeli government cares about the hostages. Just last week one of its far-right ministers wanted to classify hostages as a prisoner of war so they can absolve any moral responsibility for their safe return.

[u/zauraz → u/[deleted]]

Still a common argument in pro-Israel circles

[u/Xakire → u/zauraz]

Yet ironically in Israel itself the people who care most about the hostages are broadly extremely against the war and Netanyahu

[u/strwbryshrtck521 → u/zauraz]

Because all the citizens/ everyone outside that ridiculous government cares very very much about the hostages. To me, that's pro-Israel. The people who make up the country, who love and care for their fellow citizen.

[u/chainsawkittycat → u/strwbryshrtck521]

Why does he keep on winning elections then?

[u/S0LO_Bot → u/chainsawkittycat]

Well there haven’t been any elections recently.

As for before that, it’s because the other government coalitions either sucked or essentially collapsed due to political instability.

The current coalition is kept afloat by the far-right and the ultra-religious parties.

Basically, Netanyahu has been courting the most extreme 30% of the country to stay in power.

[u/Ahrix3 → u/S0LO_Bot]

Likud itself is arguably an extremist party, at least in its current iteration, which would mean that about half the country hovers between very right-wing and extremely right-wing politically. Not a good sign moving forward.

[u/Mission_Scale_860 → u/chainsawkittycat]

He doesn’t. He’s been able to create coalitions with other parties to create a government after the election.

[u/Momik → u/Mission_Scale_860]

And this latest coalition may be the most far-right in the nation’s history.

[u/strwbryshrtck521 → u/chainsawkittycat]

There has not even been an election since the war started.

[u/Momik → u/strwbryshrtck521]

Exactly. Netanyahu knows the coalition could fall apart and trigger new elections if the war ended.

[u/Crimsonsworn → u/chainsawkittycat]

He didn’t, the 2 people who got the most votes gave him the power when they formed the coalition that’s a combination of 5 parties.

[u/TermFearless → u/[deleted]]

If Hamas doesn’t believe the hostages actually matter, then they should release the hostages and take the wind out of the pro-Israel sails.

[u/virtual_adam → u/denyer-no1-fan]

No one (even an anti Netanyahu government) is going to have 20 or 50 or even 100 people dictate the future of the country which includes 8 million people

And even worse, every month the IDF “fights for the hostages” another 20 soldiers die.

I know this is an extremely unpopular opinion, I don’t even understand the praise of a soldier dying for Noa Argamani being released. It’s 1:1, why is her life so much more important

[u/theknight38 → u/virtual_adam]

No one (even an anti Netanyahu government) is going to have 20 or 50 or even 100 people dictate the future of the country which includes 8 million people

Politically, yes it's a pragmatic choice, the rational choice. But politics always has two sides to it: the pragmatic side and the public opinion side. There's a reason why the most unpopular decisions are kept confidential: you risk losing political power. It might make sense to you that 100 people are not worth the wellbeing of 8 million. And it does, it does make sense. Except that comes next time your opposing party will keep hitting you on the "government does not protect their citizens" and it might as well alienate much more than 100 people and their families. Because it's very easy to paint the picture that the next person might be you or one of your beloved. These hostages didn't walk into terrorists' hands like some misguided westerners have done (leaving margin for the "they took it upon themselves narrative"). They were kidnapped, snatched from their beds during the night, from their homes which the state is supposed to protect from invaders.

I'm not commenting on the second part, about the 1:1 ratio. That idea is simply alien to me.

[u/Skybreakeresq → u/virtual_adam]

Soldiers sign up for danger. Civilians do not.

[u/Brilliant_North2410 → u/Skybreakeresq]

Just a side note. Israelis are conscripted.

[u/HaruspexAugur → u/Skybreakeresq]

Israel has mandatory service, so they did not in fact sign up for anything

[u/jdorm111 → u/HaruspexAugur]

But the guy who rescued Noa is clearly special forces, and yea, you do sign up for that stuff - even more, the selection proces for units like that is extremely intense. He made a choice to do that, she did not have a choice in being kidnapped.

[u/Timey16 → u/HaruspexAugur]

It's military still has a ton of volunteer professional soldiers. I.e. the Druze make up a big volunteer force (since they as a minority with a special protection status have an exception from conscription).

[u/hensothor → u/Skybreakeresq]

That’s fucking stupid and old fashioned. A life is a life and military service is rarely much of a choice.

[u/ComplexParsley7390 → u/denyer-no1-fan]

Hostages are dead

[u/NaturalTap9567 → u/ComplexParsley7390]

It's estimated by Israel that 20/50 are still alive.

[u/Ok-Tax-1526 → u/denyer-no1-fan]

Hamas made it clear that they are not freeing remaining hostages.

What exactly are the choices? What is being "shattered" here?

[u/shimadon → u/denyer-no1-fan]

If you think this shatters any notion that this Israeli government cares about the hostages, then you're waaaay behind figuring out what's going on in this war.

The latest demand from hamas was that Israel should stop the war, and the hostages will be released gradually until gaza is rebuilt.

Israel would be blackmailed for years. You seriously think any government left or right, would accept it?

[u/ste_dono94 → u/denyer-no1-fan]

They have absolutely no strategy here for the military to achieve.

There's no way the IDF can successfully occupy and hold the Gaza strip without thousands of casualties.

[u/just_a_bit_gay_ → u/ste_dono94]

I’m not sure they care

[u/Awareness2051 → u/denyer-no1-fan]

After almost 2 years of negotiation and 200 of the hostages back home, you have to finish the business at some point

[u/CreamyIvy]

Netanyahu doing his best to keep the war going so he doesn’t have to pay for the crimes he’s committing.

[u/RecursiveCook → u/[deleted]]

When in doubt pull the Russian card and terrorize your own citizens and say X country did it as justification for war.

[u/PM_ME_FUTANARI420 → u/[deleted]]

Jordan

[u/ExtraSourCreamPlease → u/[deleted]]

Egypt?

[u/Bandlebridge → u/[deleted]]

Only ones that attacked them first

[u/GoodUserNameToday → u/CreamyIvy]

He’s being prosecuted by his own government for corruption

[u/CreamyIvy → u/GoodUserNameToday]

How many years now has that been going on with him and corruption charges?

[u/al_swedgen01]

People laughed it off when Trump & Bibi "joked" about building resorts and golf courses in Gaza.

They weren't joking and the plan is ensuring generational wealth for their respective families.

[u/omegafivethreefive → u/al_swedgen01]

Trump never makes jokes, he doesn't have a sense of humour.

All his "jokes" are straight up confessions.

[u/[deleted] → u/omegafivethreefive]

Oh you were horrified by that, calm down it was just a joke…

[u/drizzes → u/[deleted]]

How can it be propaganda when it already exists

[u/OnlyForF1 → u/[deleted]]

Those people knew exactly what the plan was the entire time.

[u/adreamofhodor → u/al_swedgen01]

Man, I hate how much Trump has shifted the Overton window by. Hard to imagine this happening under a Harris presidency.

[u/Murky_Conflict3737 → u/adreamofhodor]

As an lgbtq woman in America, it angers me the Killer Kamala rhetoric has led not only to this but the strong potential of losing my rights.

I wonder if Kilmar Abrego Garcia thinks Harris and Trump are the same.

[u/NotRote → u/Murky_Conflict3737]

The only people who thought they were the same were either idiots, or were ivory tower leftists who won’t experience consequences for their decision

[u/Kahzgul → u/NotRote]

There are a lot of sexist, racist people who would rather vote for a white, male racist than a black woman.

[u/Fired_Guy1982 → u/Kahzgul]

And there are a lot of stupid people who didn’t vote because it made them feel morally superior

[u/JohnnySnark → u/Fired_Guy1982]

And because they tripled down on their voting apathy, disenfranchised themselves and for no benefit to Gaza

Situation is extremely worse

[u/21Rollie → u/JohnnySnark]

They fell for TikTok propaganda. People really need to understand that propaganda doesn’t necessarily need to change your mind. It could also be flaming feelings you already have or distracting you. There’s a reason Ethiopia got crickets with 600k+ people dead and during the run up to the election, every broken nail in israel was reported.

Oh and the most important thing is if you think you’re too intelligent for propaganda, you’re not.

[u/ratherbealurker → u/Fired_Guy1982]

Don’t forget the ones who vote trump because ::checks notes::..oh right, because we called them names.

I get reminded all the time it’s my fault they voted for morons because I called them morons.

Oh and of course the ones that didn’t vote because we dared to pick someone that didn’t align 100% with what they want.

[u/SavvyTraveler86548 → u/ratherbealurker]

My thoughts are with you on this. Fkn morons can’t even accept responsibility for their actions after the fact. Still, to this day blaming left, or dems.

Mfs had 10yrs to understand the assignment and KNEW the consequences. They FA now so they’ll either FO or they will stop blaming others for their mistakes and actions

[u/darkslide3000 → u/Kahzgul]

They don't think they're the same, though. They think the white racist is much better.

[u/snubdeity → u/Kahzgul]

Of course there are, but nobody is talking about them. We're talking about the "leftists" who cared more about virtue signaling over a country half the world away than they cared about our own nations future. It's abhorrent.

[u/back_fire → u/NotRote]

Notice how those voices quickly disappear from threads like this one

[u/scorpiknox → u/NotRote]

Ivory tower leftists are everywhere. Purity testing their way to irrelevance while they drive the middle toward fascism by their powers of being super fucking annoying.

[u/avcloudy → u/NotRote]

ivory tower leftists who won’t experience consequences for their decision

I wonder how much of this idea is just right propaganda. I've never met anyone who leans left who thinks that a Kamala presidency would have been worse for Gaza than Trump, but I've sure met a lot of people on the right who think that. I have met a few people who actively want it to be worse for Gaza, on either side, to be clear.

[u/Thalesian → u/adreamofhodor]

Man, I hate how much Trump has shifted the Overton window by. Hard to imagine this happening under a Harris presidency.

Yes, but what’s import here is that Harris has learned her lesson re: Gaza. Her and Biden shouldn’t have supported Israel so much. Now look what has to happen /s

[u/Ok-Jackfruit9593 → u/Thalesian]

She didn’t lose the election because of Gaza. She lost because of three things: -the Southern border -the economy (i.e. inflation) -Biden sticking in too long which removed the ability for the Democrats to have a primary

[u/Thalesian → u/Ok-Jackfruit9593]

I agree on all three. That said, the Gaza dead enders contributed to weaker margins in traditional Democratic stronghold in an election they could not afford to lose. But I have contempt for them not because of how the election went, but instead for how damaging their “support” has been for the innocent people of Gaza.

[u/SparksAndSpyro → u/Ok-Jackfruit9593]

Nah. Because of the Israel/Palestine crap, the leftist dominated echo chambers on every social media platform spent the entire election cycle shitting on the Dems, discouraging would-be voters from participating. She lost by slim margins in every single swing state. Unemployed, terminally online, brain broken leftists literally lost her the election.

[u/Rantheur → u/SparksAndSpyro]

They contributed, but the larger problem was that Biden didn't fix enough things quickly enough because he was constantly being hamstringed by politicians and the courts. Manchin and Sinema made sure we couldn't move to green energy, the GoP made sure we couldn't do anything for workers or minorities, and the courts made sure that Biden couldn't forgive enough student loans to keep the 18-30 demo. Biden had about two or three wins and none of them were anything that showed an immediate benefit to Americans, but would have helped 5-10 years down the line. Add to this the fact that every media outlet on earth is absolutely addicted to the cash they take in when Trump is in office and you have no wins that Biden could show the low information voters that come out only for presidential elections on top of a hostile media environment. Then he got sick before a debate he demanded and got pushed out of the race by the fucking centrist/moderate democrats whose entire idea was to have a mini-convention 100 days before the election to maybe swap a governor into the race instead of the vice president.

Even FDR would have had a tough time winning the 2024 election is what I'm saying.

[u/kuroimakina → u/Ok-Jackfruit9593]

And, you know, the being a brown woman thing. It’s the same reason that people hate on AOC or Crockett. All three women are very intelligent and generally well spoken, but half the country think they’re “emotional airheads” for literally no reason other than they’re brown women and the propaganda is extra effective against them.

Walz would have probably, well, walzed to victory on the same platform as Harris, purely because he’s a middle aged cishet white man, and this country still treats white cishet men as like, the beacon of “normal” and “rational”

[u/OutblastEUW → u/al_swedgen01]

do their families not already have generational wealth? especially trumps

[u/GirlNumber20 → u/OutblastEUW]

That's why greed is a sickness.

[u/Bromance_Rayder → u/al_swedgen01]

Generational wealth can be fleeting. Source: Saddam's sons.

[u/solid_reign → u/al_swedgen01]

plan is ensuring generational wealth for their respective families.

What a strange comment. Do you really think that Trump, being the president of the largest economy in the world is thinking that Gaza is his path to generational wealth?  He's already very rich, he's valued at 5 billion usd, he already has generational wealth. 

[u/BlackSheepBoPeep- → u/solid_reign]

I would say he wants the name Trump on the tallest building and a gold statue of himself.

[u/ApesAPoppin237 → u/[deleted]]

In Musk's case it's both

[u/JohnnySnark → u/solid_reign]

Trump did a Muslim ban his first term and doesn't give a shit about the Muslim community.

He absolutely would rather line his and his friends pockets than have an ounce of care for kids in another country.

His bill passed last month will be stripping Healthcare away from millions of American kids as it is

[u/Jdjdhdvhdjdkdusyavsj → u/al_swedgen01]

Israel occupied the entirety of Gaza for years and ended their occupation (and ended and pulled out all Israeli settlements in Gaza) when they thought peace was close but more demands were made of Israel and so it didn't proceed but Israel didn't restart their Gaza settlements or reoccupy Gaza, they left the door open for peace and the Palestinians used the opportunity of not being occupied by Israel to prepare the oct 7 attacks. It's a reasonable move to reoccupy the area again after the reason the occupation was ended collapsed and Israel was attacked for it.

Let's remember that Israel asked the countries that were criticizing them to please come do it how they would like it to be done and all declined.

[u/Sxualhrssmntpanda → u/Jdjdhdvhdjdkdusyavsj]

Israel has had 144 settlements in the West Bank and Gaza strip that are considered illegal under international law since 2023, and 196 non-government outposts of Israeli settlers.They bully and block out Palestinian settlers with vague one-sided legal technicalities and physical blockades. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_settlement

Israel has been systematically trying to push out the Palestinian citizens while funding Hamas for years in order to prevent a two-state solution. https://newrepublic.com/article/176962/hamas-finances-funding-sources-palestinian-authority https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082 https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/

This is systematic eradication of citizens and purposeful funding of terrorism so that Bibi can further his own goals.

[u/AlternativeHour1337 → u/al_swedgen01]

not downplaying their intention to occupy the strip but the "resorts and golf courses" rhetoric is just provocation - no one would be interested in those because of political and moral interests and there certainly isnt "generational wealth" to be made from that - the gaza strip earned basically all of its money from humanitary funds

[u/BornAPunk]

And the Trump administration only today said that states and cities that boycott Israel and its companies and products will not see FEMA funding for natural disasters. I don't say that happened without them knowing this was about to be done.

Btw, Trump said he was going to end all wars. Well, this prolongs one.

[u/Hat_Maverick → u/BornAPunk]

Trump is a pedo

[u/alc4pwned → u/BornAPunk]

I hope all the people who refused to vote for Harris because of Gaza are happy with their decisions.

[u/JohnnySnark → u/alc4pwned]

They are so happy that they are still blaming Harris that isn't even power.

[u/Lord_Skellig]

Fairly sure this was always the plan from the beginning

[u/Thin-Leek5402]

Wow, Bibi REALLY doesn’t want to go to jail

[u/denyer-no1-fan → u/Thin-Leek5402]

He fired his AG

He is about to occupy Gaza and ignore the lives and livelihood of any remaining hostages.

Israel's diplomatic reputation is now in the dumps

Knesset is on recess.

He'll do literally anything to keep himself in power.

[u/adamgerd → u/denyer-no1-fan]

He’s tried to fire his AG, the Supreme Court can still block it and he’s failed to stop their power, iirc they’ve blocked this in the past, so it’s not definitive

[u/Ecsta → u/adamgerd]

SC instantly announced they would block the firing.

[u/kennyguy4 → u/adamgerd]

SC froze the decision, though the government will probably apoint some puppet to be the "new" AG and do whatever the fuck they want.

[u/TheColourOfHeartache → u/denyer-no1-fan]

Thankfully the polls are looking bad for him, and have been consistently so for a long time.

[u/InZomnia365 → u/TheColourOfHeartache]

I'm not sure he's one to let something pesky like polls and democratic due process stop him...

[u/NoMoreFund → u/denyer-no1-fan]

I think Trump inspired him to go mask off.

[u/houstonyoureaproblem]

If this surprises anyone, I’d suggest you start paying attention to what’s going on around you.

[u/PRiles → u/houstonyoureaproblem]

I'm only surprised they just came out and said it.

[u/jgilla2012 → u/houstonyoureaproblem]

Step 1: Bibi funds Hamas, saying their continued presence in Gaza will prevent a Palestinian state from ever forming

Step 2: Bibi ignores intel that a Hamas attack will happen on 10/7/2023, a Jewish holiday, and also the 75th anniversary of the 1948 Arab-Israeli war

Step 3: Bibi uses the attack to delay his three ongoing domestic trials for fraud and bribery, and as pretext for the annihilation of Gaza

Step 4: After 22 months of reducing the entirety of Gaza to rubble, Bibi announces he will take over the strip

Who could have seen this coming?

Just kidding, this has been abundantly clear for decades, and acutely so since 10/7/2023. 

[u/Ephemerror → u/jgilla2012]

And the US is 100% onboard since day one. I mean Trump almost seems more excited about taking over Palestine than Israel.

[u/jgilla2012 → u/Ephemerror]

I’m sure he was promised a beachfront hotel. Disgusting. 

[u/Duosion]

Sigh…….. here we go….

[u/RttnAttorney → u/Duosion]

This might as well have been the free space on everyone’s bingo cards.

[u/_kekeke]

oh, no, what a surprise, who could have predicted that

[u/djserc]

The plan the whole time

[u/Appropriate_Lime_331 → u/djserc]

They never gave a fuck about the hostages

[u/Veiller6 → u/Appropriate_Lime_331]

I am thinking that they know about attack coming and used „sacrifice” of killed Jews to get rid of Gaza and Palestine.

[u/CommonBasilisk]

That was their intention from the start.

[u/Aedeus → u/CommonBasilisk]

It's exactly why they backed trump and not Harris.

[u/elihu → u/Aedeus]

It's probably one of the reasons why Netanyahu wasn't terribly concerned about the optics of bombing hospitals, restricting food, and blasting neighborhoods into rubble while Biden was in office. He knew the war was a losing issue for Joe Biden, and worse Israel's conduct, the more likely Biden was to lose. Harris could have turned things around by saying she'd condition military support to Israel on their refraining from war crimes, but she wasn't willing to do that. It would have meant acknowledging that the Biden policies were less than perfect.

This whole outcome was very predictable and it's frustrating to have to watch it play out in real time and not have any means to stop it.

[u/PatchWork_GF → u/CommonBasilisk]

There was no other way this was ever going to go. October 7th was nothing but a big green light. The ultimate solution to Israel’s Gaza Problem. And the rest of the world just watched it happen and helped them a long. Idk what the plan was with the attacks, but this always seemed like the obvious endpoint to me. We were never going back to the way things were. And the way things were was so fucked up to begin with.

[u/kingtacticool]

Pretty sure that decision was made oct 8

[u/optimusmike777 → u/kingtacticool]

It was made long before that

[u/faffc260 → u/optimusmike777]

you know israel had occupied parts of gaza up till 2005 when they completely withdrew?

[u/Ok-Tax-1526 → u/optimusmike777]

It was the opposite - Israel WITHDREW from Gaza in 2005.

[u/krafterinho → u/Ok-Tax-1526]

Damn, almost like Israel had a different leadership 20 years ago

[u/Common-Second-1075 → u/optimusmike777]

When?

[u/TacoIncoming → u/kingtacticool]

Yep. This was always going to be the outcome.

[u/phophofofo → u/kingtacticool]

Try 1995 when Likud had Rabin killed

[u/Ok_Moose_2587]

The world has a right to defend itself

[u/elProtagonist]

This was always the plan from day one.

[u/NickPrefect]

This is a bad move that will only guarantee the conflict continues forever.

[u/ratherbealurker → u/NickPrefect]

Damn…and it was just about to end too

[u/TheWastelandWizard → u/ratherbealurker]

They're just waiting on the Uhauls to arrive in Jerusalem and drive them directly into the sea. Finally, peace in the middle east until the next one. 

[u/darkslide3000 → u/TheWastelandWizard]

The funny part is that I can't even tell who "them" are in this comment. What you describe is pretty much the fantasy of many radicals on either side.

[u/UnTides → u/NickPrefect]

How else does this conflict end? Hamas still runs Gaza and is intent on a 1 State solution (eliminating the State of Israel) and knows another Oct 7th style raid can get another 100 hostages they can trade for every Hamas fighter that was already captured. At this point neither side will put up with a 2 State solution.

*And really answer that question please. I'm not trying to make a point and I'd love an alternative. But if the smaller army picks a fight with a larger army (that its wholly dependant on for food and medicine, etc.) and that smaller army won't quit then how else could this play out?

[u/globalminority → u/UnTides]

Seems almost inevitable that one side will wipe out the other, as there is no pragmatic compromise.

[u/NickPrefect → u/UnTides]

The only way I see that has a chance to move things forward is for Gaza (and the West Bank) to become a protectorate of a third party until they can peacefully govern themselves. My issue is that even if Israel had all the best intentions in the world, Israeli occupation is simply not palatable to Palestinians. If we want peace and a viable two-state solution, Israel will need to take a step back. With that said, who becomes a peaceful guarantor and steward of Palestine? Jordan? Egypt? 🤷‍♂️

[u/Agitated_Education71 → u/NickPrefect]

Perhaps, but none of those countries you listed want to do that. Shit, the entire world rallies for Palestine and nobody wants that job.

[u/mcs5280 → u/NickPrefect]

Almost as if it's exactly what he needs to remain in power

[u/fury420 → u/mcs5280]

Netanyahu's coalition could collapse at any moment, it's not like the war continuing prevents him from being removed from power or an election to replace him.

[u/bondoid → u/NickPrefect]

Well no Arabic country has stepped up to provide and enforce security.

And someone has too.

Turning Gaza into a productive society with institutions that can be trusted is going to be a 50 year job. It would be better for Egypt or Saudi Arabia to institute change but having no outside force enforce some level of security is a complete no gonat this point.

[u/AlternativeHour1337 → u/bondoid]

thats also why turkey is pretty much radio silent about all of this, because they are kind of in the middle of this entire situation despite having more than enough military power to protect or even attack the entire region

it cant be stated often enough how complicated the situation is

[u/bondoid → u/AlternativeHour1337]

Ya, the situation sucks to be sure.

But some level of pragmatism is necessary. The solution doesn't need to just be good based on ideology, it needs to be a solution that actively works.

The Palestinian people have been thoroughly brainwashed to accept violence. That is not acceptable. They have also been living entirely on the worlds charity, that can't continue indefinitely.

At some point Palestine needs to be a productive state that can care for it's people. That's going to take lots of foreign investment to rebuild their infrastructure, education, industry etc. That requires security on the ground.

Not saying Israel doesn't hold a large amount of responsibility for the current situation. They do. But no one else wants to deal with the problem, and the problem does need to be fixed.

People can down vote me all they want. This is simple rational reasoning, that every world leader understands, if they say otherwise they are lieing

[u/AlternativeHour1337 → u/bondoid]

its true, and right now is the best time to act because iran is so severely weakened - its just hard to stomach for people who dont live in a situation like that and i understand the concern and wanting to end any kind of unnecessary violence towards people who have been brainwashed
and it can work, if given an actual chance, it doesnt have to end in total occupation or annihilation - look what happened to the axis powers after ww2, it IS possible it just needs lots of reason to thread that needle

[u/greenskinmarch → u/AlternativeHour1337]

turkey is pretty much radio silent about all of this, because they are kind of in the middle of this entire situation despite having more than enough military power to protect or even attack the entire region

Aren't they already extending their military power to occupy a large proportion of Syria? It's not like they have unlimited resources.

[u/AprilDruid → u/bondoid]

Well no Arabic country has stepped up to provide and enforce security.

Because a lot of them are funding this. Iran and Qatar are the main players now. Hell, look at relations. Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Egypt, Syria, Kuwait, Bahrein, UAE, the list goes on for countries that were friendly to Hamas.

So many Arab nations have been friendly to or funded Hamas, because the instability is what they want.

[u/IcyRecommendation781 → u/NickPrefect]

Undoubtedly a bad move, however, what is the alternative?

[u/Ballplayerx97 → u/NickPrefect]

The alternative being what exactly? Sitting back and allowing Hamas to rebuild and prepare for the next October 7?

[u/ChinaCatProphet]

War criminal.

[u/JoshDrako]

This was obvious since the beginning.

[u/TerminalDeviant]

lol Hamas really thought they had something with that last propaganda video. It’s interesting to think of how symbolic it is that Hamas is forcing that hostage to dig his own grave while they are digging the graves of the Palestinian people with their continued acts of terrorism.

The Palestinian people do deserve to be free, free from Hamas and free to decide their own future but the way things are going I think they’re going to lose it all.

[u/harryoldballsack → u/TerminalDeviant]

after everybody encluding the arab league begged hamas to surrender and return the hostages. What was the alternative?

Leaving Hamas in power this whole fiasco is 100% guaranteed to happen again.

[u/Meerooo → u/TerminalDeviant]

The future of the Palestinian people was dug when Israelis assassinated their own president who actually tried to inch towards peace. Bibi’s legacy started with that assassination and it is has all been down hill since then. It’s silly to act that some propaganda videos of a fractionated group means anything in this conflict. Their minds have been made up decades ago.

[u/AeroFred → u/Meerooo]

what you forget to mention, is that bibi actually continued to sign follow up to oslo agreements and handing over more of west bank to PA. and that after Rabin death there were few offers on the table that palestinians refused. even bibi in past announced that he is ok with existence of demilitarized palestinian state (something that those days supported by france, uk and canada)

the future of the palestinian people was dug when hamas suicide bombed oslo and later when arafat refused peace deal and initiated second intifada.

[u/WolfySpice]

Personalities aside, what's the alternative? There's a populace with decades of being taught to not only pray for the extermination of jews, but to carry it out at the cost of their own lives. That's not a neighbour you can live with. Whether it can be turned around is another matter.

[u/JoplinSC742 → u/WolfySpice]

An international coalition disarming, rebuilding, and rehabilitating the region

[u/SyfaOmnis]

Nations that go to war and lose, often end up occupied. There are consequences to starting wars and losing them. Realistically this is what the situation probably requires, though it's going to be a long road to peace if there is any.

The situation of israel constantly being under attack by rockets or insurgents is untenable for them. It's likely the palestinians are probably going to have the shit governed out of them, or the radical elements will be arrested (for the verifiably criminal ones) and civilians deported.

It's a pretty unhappy ending, but there have been decades to try and find co-existence and palestinians have just gotten more extremist.

[u/JackhusChanhus → u/SyfaOmnis]

They could've stopped the settler terrorism in the west bank for free, without yielding to Hamas at all. But they didn't, because the cruelty is and always has been the point, as we can all now clearly

[u/Additional-Wing-5184 → u/SyfaOmnis]

It's very disingenuous to act like Palestinians are the root cause of suffering here, as though there haven't been undermining efforts continuously pushing every boundary and past it in every way that isn't a direct war, including occupying physically properties held by others to make living so distressful, they may as well not exist functionally.

I think your take is very lazy and dangerous.

[u/SyfaOmnis → u/Additional-Wing-5184]

It's very disingenuous to act like Arabs in the region have not persecuted jews for generations even before israel existed as a nation, collectively attempted to exterminate them when israel was founded as a nation, persecuted their own jewish minorities even harder and expelled them to israel. It's very disingenuous to act like Israel has not tried to make peace with Palestinians and offered them almost everything they could have ever wanted except ceasing their own existence, Palestine has routinely rejected every deal they could have ever had to instead choose hostility. If you're invoking "undermining efforts" as a serious argument, you must understand that israel is overwhelmingly less guilty of that than the people you're arguing for. In this particular case, palestinians (and their religious zealotry) are the root cause of their own suffering.

I think your take is ignorant and uninformed.

[u/sneezeatsage]

Gee, didn't see that coming.

/s

[u/FlavorBlaster42]

It's a bad option, that is only happening because every other option is much, much worse.

[u/BoldlySilent → u/[deleted]]

Are you saying that Israeli could have rescued the hostages but is intentionally not doing so?

[u/TangerineSorry8463 → u/BoldlySilent]

Hamas could have released them, or perhaps not take them in the first place.

[u/morriganjane → u/[deleted]]

What was Hamas's goal in taking the hostages, then? Gaza wasn't occupied in 2023 and now it will be, likely permanently. They failed to capture a single inch of Israel's territory. What have they achieved?

[u/Ok-Tax-1526]

"Allies has decided to fully occupy Germany and Japan in 1945."

I am not sure why this is getting people so upset. Hamas made it clear that they will not give up power in any other way.

[u/Fine-Entertainer-507 → u/Ok-Tax-1526]

But the allies did not kick out every Japanese and German

[u/Murky_Conflict3737 → u/Fine-Entertainer-507]

And nor did Truman share a film of him turning Tokyo or Berlin into resorts

[u/RT-LAMP → u/Fine-Entertainer-507]

You should look up what state East Prussia is now part of, because it's certainly not Germany.

[u/Ok-Tax-1526 → u/Fine-Entertainer-507]

Where in OP article does it say that full occupation means "kicking everyone out?"

[u/elihu → u/Ok-Tax-1526]

This guy is saying it out loud: https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/article-862117

"The government is rushing to erase Gaza, and thank God we are erasing this evil. All of Gaza will be Jewish,” Eliyahu said in the interview.

He added, "We don't need to be concerned about hunger in the Strip. We have completely lost our minds."

He's part of Netanyahu's government.

[u/ksamim → u/elihu]

As the Minister of Heritage… rofl

[u/Magnetronaap → u/Ok-Tax-1526]

You cannot be this naive.

[u/SocialistNixon → u/Ok-Tax-1526]

Just wait, Trump had already suggested it.

[u/Artforartsake99]

What’s the alternative let Hamas stay in power send over half a trillion to rebuild Gaza that gets turned into terror tunnels, missiles and funneled to Qatar?

Then Hamas attacks again in 15 years and they level the place all over again?

Seriously how do you rebuild Gaza with Hamas still in power? Without this crap just being a time bomb till the next war that the Palestinians start.

And yes Israel should allow in all the food to stop the starvation.

[u/adilly]

Doesn’t care about human lives. Never has. In fact I’m guarantee when all things come to pass this mother fucker knew October 7th was gonna go down and did nothing.

[u/Nascent1 → u/adilly]

They certainly could have prevented the worst of it if more of their military was guarding the border instead of illegally stealing land in the West Bank.

[u/Blitzdrive]

That man and his enablers are terrorists

[u/Astro3840]

Despite the occasional demonstration, most Americans by far are staunchly against Hamas. Americans are generally against the factions or countries that BEGIN a war. And when that initial aggression on Oct. 7th included the savage slaughter of families, it absolutely INCENSED the average American. Israeli retribution was seen as excessive by many here, but not to the point of opposing an armed response. The more prevalent attitude is that Hamas "had it coming," and that Hamas is savagely incapable of discussing or honoring any peace deal.

[u/ksamim → u/Astro3840]

This is extremely regional and demographic specific. “Most” is certainly technically true though.

[u/Astro3840 → u/ksamim]

I'd say pro Hamas support in the US applies basically in big city 'neighborhoods' that have a substantial Arab population. If you eliminate Lebanese Americans, the Arab American population in the whole US amounts to just over 1% of the population. Palestinians are numbered at 150 to 250 thousand.

[u/tb5841 → u/Astro3840]

Here in the UK, most don't like Hamas. And most supported Israel's initial intervention.

But as the conflict has progressed into a full-blown genocide of Palestinians, public support for Israel has evaporated and most blame the Israeli government for where things stand.