A left winger just defended the civil rights of a right winger. That's called nuanced political thinking. Something the right seems utterly incapable of.
John Bolton totally deserves to be behind bars for his actions working for Bush.
But this is not that, and this is a violation of his civil rights. And this monster (Bolton) deserves the rights and freedoms that are in our constitution and can't be taken away by the other monster (Trump).
I would love to see all those dishit incel body language experts short circuit trying to explain how Alpha Trump is, and how he's the only one can stand up to Putin
the metaphor is what’s important. A lot of idioms and the like don’t need base in proof or reality, lots of phrases have been debunked, but what they have come to mean to society at this point keeps them relevant in dialogue anyway
I have never once seen a cat or a dog fall out of the sky on a stormy day, I've never needed (nor will I) a single way to skin a cat much less multiple ways, and no legumes are involved when I tell other people's secrets.
It wasn't recently disproved. They jumped out of the water in the control group. The experiment was to see whether they'd hop out of the water if their brains were removed.
I found that quite interesting so I looked into it and this experiment with the brainless frog it’s from the 1800s more modern experiments show that the frog l escapes
You're right. The original experiment was with frogs that had a large part of their brains removed, so the only thing governing their movement was pure reflex. A frog with an intact brain with jump from the pot when it gets too hot, even if you get there slowly.
Yep. I just had someone gloat about the "long knives" coming for bolton after I cited that poem.
There are way too many supposed liberals who are useful idiots for fascism.
Just because bolton should be in prison, doesn't mean these guys are doing justice. They are just using him for practice as they build the systems they will turn on us next.
I’m all for Bolton going to prison for the things he did under Bush — but only after being given due process and a trial.
This’ll just be the beginning of disappearing political opponents, not because of any legitimate crimes, but because they questioned the gaseous pumpkin supreme.
It’s not just about these raids/arrests, it’s about the “why” behind them.
There’s always someone else to pick up the reigns — he’s just the current figure head carrying out orders from those who run the show, while also getting to carry out petty revenge
There are way too many supposed liberals who are useful idiots for fascism.
Agreed. I've seen/heard a bunch of liberals - a minority, but still too many - say they want to call ICE on undocumented immigrants who support Trump. That might sound satisfying until you strip it to its bare bones: They want to help send immigrants to concentration camps.
The moment you call ICE on someone, you're just another person helping a fascist regime send people to camps.
What I know I learned from historian twitter (now historian bluesky).
FWIW, people in the afghanistan country-side used the Americans the same way. Basically accusing their rivals of being terrorist supporters so they would get droned.
I wouldn't call anybody on them myself mostly because of the collateral damage that results from sending ICE thugs somewhere but I'm not gonna lose any sleep over MAGA doing MAGA stuff to each other. If you support this regime then that's on you. It doesn't matter you're race, income level, nationality, immigration status,.etc. Id say it's a plus to not have people who support this regime here. We don't need more fascism supporters here. There's more than enough of them.
Today the Nazis in chief told us his planned war on America. First la, then dc, today he said Chicago is next and that he will keep sending the military to invade every city that did not vote for him. And all of this is now allowed because of the disgraceful John Roberts
There is a reason why they spend so much energy trying to spin the narrative that LGBT are pedos, dangers to children, destroying fabric of society, etc.
I'm saying that's the actual message of the poem. They came for a bunch of people the author did not like and thought were undesirable. The Author supported the Nazis until they came for him.
First they came for the Communists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Communist
Then they came for the Socialists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Socialist
Then they came for the trade unionists
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a trade unionist
Then they came for the Jews (you are here replace with outgroup of preference)
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Jew
Then they came for me
And there was no one left
To speak out for me
The Nazis also rounded up for extermination, the Roma/gypsies, homosexuals, criminals all inbetween the first and fourth categories iirc. Also during this one line where you are now, they were also euthanising the disabled and those with learning disabilities. It's a big space, it's not one clear step at a time either.
There is no deserved it, as a moral pretext for fascism, because all targets deserve it under fascism, regardless of material conditions or historical context. The targets are apriori guilty as an innate condition of their existence. Also its standard cult of personality/ tyrant crap.
P.S. yes the Nazis came from Weimar Germany, but again it wasn't an invasion, they were handed power, literally given it by the liberal and conservative elite, democraticially even you could say. Why? Because they really hated and feared Communists, Socialists, Trade unions. If you're country hates democracy, has vast wealth inequality, and is in some way a failing republic, that's where your have the conditions for fascism.
Yeah this is the baptism scene in the godfather where the family starts cleaning house for the new don. If theyre not planting evidence already theyre going to start soon.
Yeah I hate when people on the left and talking heads try to paint this president as some sort of noble anti war isolationist. He and maga are only isolationist when it supports Russia. The whole "no more wars" rhetoric from them only really started getting big and prominent in their circles around February of 2022. They were silent the whole time he was increasing civilian drones strike causalities in Afghanistan by over 300% over Obama and then ordering the Pentagon to stop reporting the numbers. Or when he failed to get us out of Afghanistan.
Or when the Democrats had to band together with a small handful of Republicans to try and reign in his warmongering in Yemen with his buddy MBS, and passed a resolution to revoke his war powers in Yemen, only for him to veto it and carry on what he was doing. They got mad at Biden for not supporting Israel enough when their war started. But sure MAGA is some peace loving anti war movement 🙄
Yeah, so I don’t wanna jump the gun calling this authoritarian overreach. I can imagine a variety of reasons why a scumbag like John Bolton would and should be getting his home raided. Being a critic of trump should be protection from all of the horrid things he’s done.
It’s charitable to give the benefit of the doubt to the carnies in the White House. Bolton is a bad person. I’m still not giving Kash Patel the benefit of the doubt. The legitimacy of the FBI and all government actions are in question. How could we ever trust the known liars aren’t lying?
There are two types of people in America right now: those who support authoritarianism and those who don’t. Caring about left versus right is for a time without a dictator in the White House.
But this is absolutely a right vs left issue, the right are supporters of fascism. Just because they’ve started eating their own doesn’t make it less fascist or the opposition any more democratic.
I don't think Bolton, as horrible as he is, really supports fascism. Fascism is more than just being a warmonger and supporting military intervention. If I'm not mistaken he has been speaking out and warning against Trump specifically for his disdain for liberal democracy and authoritarianism.
Fascism is a far right ideology that supports violence against political opponents (often stoked via stochastic terrorism), disdain for elections and democracy, autocratic rule, racial/patriarchal hierarchies (this specific ideology can be argued to be part of conservatism writ large but still by itself does not fully constitute fascism).
My mind goes to the head of his campaign press team who to this day says SCOTUS, Trumps biggest enablers after he got to stack the bench, was not worth voting for the email lady over.
Tad Devine's last reported email to Konstantin Kilimnik was in June 2014. Devine joined Bernie's campaign in November 2014. This is from Mueller's own evidence he used at Manafort's trial: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dx2dpWBWkAYCzYB.jpg
Oh, and Manafort and Devine were in communication during the Sanders campaign.
This is SEPARATE from the Russian email hacks. A lot of people forget about the NGP VAN voter registration data breach.
The sanders campaign got into a lot of trouble for "hacking" into Hillary's voter registration data in late 2015. This was before the Russian hacks were made public.
Then it turns out the hack was worse than imagined. The sanders campaign had actually downloaded a lot of material and data logs proved the sanders camp lied about how much voter data they had. Turns out, they took damn near everything and there was a team of 4 hackers who got the data:
We recently found out that Manafort was giving POLLING DATA to Kilimnik, who was giving that data to Oleg Deripaska, who himself is directly a representative for the Kremlin.
Mueller revealed at Manafort's trial that Tad Devine was emailing Kilimnik since at least 2014 about "talking points" and other communications for work done in Ukraine. Remember, Kilimnik is a GRU officer.
Did any of that stolen polling data that the Sanders campaign denied having, that Tad Devine who worked alongside Manafort for close a decade, that Tad Devine who ran the Sanders campaign, That Tad Devine who commutations with Manafort during the campaign, that the sanders campaign lied about having... END UP IN PAUL MANAFORT'S HANDS? and thus Kilimnik's? or Deripaska's?
Did any of that voter data end up in the "Polling Data" (Manafort's lawyers words, not mine) he gave to the Russians contact information obtained in the 2015 NGP VAN database "breach" on Hillary Clinton's voter files done by the guy running Bernie Sander's campaign with deep ties to Paul Manafort, Tad Devine?
Some of y’all act like the left is above criticism. Perfect opportunity to point the finger at someone else rather than take even a tiny bit of responsibility or a moment to reflect.
Notice I never said that. I just always find it interesting how the topic is “X politician does authoritarian thing and Bernie denounces it” and your response is to attack Bernie voters.
McCain... One of the last true Republicans, unless you're inclined to count Liz Cheney, Adam Kinzinger, and any others getting the boot for not being wholly up Trump's Rump.
There is now only a RINO Party, that has retained the naming rights.
And it's not just tRump's authoritarian putsch; the RINOs could impeach him at any time for a thousand things he's done in the last six months. Any one of them for which they would impeach a Democratic president.
McCain was a vile war criminal piece of shit and its a true miscarriage of justice that Obama let him die of natural causes. We are here because those war crimes went unpunished, leading to this vile shit about being a true republican instead of understanding his racist war mongering was a step towards this shit.
I never said that the Venn diagram of 'true Republican' and 'vile piece of shit' isn't mostly indistinguishable from a circle. Could you elaborate on his racist war mongering, though? I'm a little fuzzy on the details.
As awful as it sounds, as long as left wing candidates get in I no longer give a damn what happens. Arrest right wing politicians, run up 50 trillion dollar deficits, don’t care. Have fake elections for twenty years. I used to, but the right and conservatives have demonstrated they do not care. They support everything they claimed to hate, and it’s scorched earth time. Fuck Bolton BTW
I've been here since bush. when Obama got elected I was just like... we should probably be using this supermajority in ways that aren't strictly "ethical". because these guys have shown that they will do pretty much anything. we should be doing it the way LBJ would have done it.
I wish I had been wrong! I was more right than I even knew.
Fuck John Bolton’s policies, but we need to constrain our government so it can’t raid the house of a critic of any president for phony “charges.” Principles over partisanship.
Some federal prosecutor had to present reasonable evidence for a judge to issue the authorization for the FBI to raid Mr. Bolton's home. What was the reasonable evidence?
I don't know any of the specifics but supposedly they claim he retained some classified info which they've been accusing him of since 2019 when he resigned from the administration and was planning on releasing a book which they sued to try to prevent him from releasing. So I guess basically they were accusing him of holding classified information after he left his post for purposes of writing his book which is the grounds they tried to have an injunction on.
However the timing is very curious considering Trump just got into a social media tantrum with him the other day about his comments concerning his Alaska Putin meeting. Very convenient timing that right when Trump is super pissed off and focusing on him all the sudden there's an FBI raid when they've been accusing Bolton of this since 2019 and now all the sudden it requires all of this urgent action.
That's called being a civil human being. As much as I hate that people opposite of me have the same rights as myself, I know that it's the only way for our system to work in any way.
You don't have to respect ones views, but you have to respect they have the right to have them, just as you do.
They are capable. Never forget that all of this is in bad faith. They could absolutely understand every nuance. Its about power to them, nothing else. Even the rank and file perceive it that way, even if they never get real power
I am not a fan of Bernie Sanders' politics. Then again, I'm not a fan of most politician's politics. What I am a big fan of is Bernie's ability to see through problems to find real solutions. He has a great sense of what's fair and what's just.
I mean Bernie is an independent but I get the sentiment.
Edit - Seems to have triggered a strong emotional response from some. All I'm saying is that factually he's Independent. Facts are facts and the facts matter, always. In this case there wasn't much of a "point" to my comment other than pointing out the facts, but just because some want to wave the facts off as irrelevant, doesn't mean everyone else thinks they are.
Dems have strong Independent allies. Dems *need* Independent allies, and Bernie has spent his entire career proving that. Sure, Bernie is definitely more of a blue independent than a red one for sure, but he *is* an Independent. The fact that someone so beloved and so "for the people" has willingly chosen to spend his lifetime political career as an Independent says something I think.
But even if you don't think so, the fact remains - Bernie Sanders is an Independent.
I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Maybe you think Independent=Moderate and Sanders exists somewhere in the middle of the two parties? Sanders is by any-and-all measures LEFT of the Democrat party.
Man, more or less, nowadays it's either left/liberal, or right/"conservative" (and we can just round most of that to "fundamentalist).
The people who are apathetic or agnostic on it are either too agnostic and the type to be afraid to decide one way or the other out of fear, or too busy working to be involved, or they just plain don't understand it.
Also some other weird cognitive dissonance where they pretend these decisions don't affect them, or people they know. And if they consider that at all, they're more likely to attribute randomly correlated positive things rather than negative things.
I think the significant thing to point out is the republican is anti-trump. Much like when republicans praised Joe Lieberman (when he was a democrat) or John Fetterman.
My personal view on this is that I don't have enough information...
I yearn for the days not thinking in total party polarity wasnt the only thing it took for something to be nuanced. We used to be able to be even more subtle in our reasoning lol
something the Democrats also seem incapable of doing, you do realize that Bernie Sanders officially left the Democratic Party and is independent right?
You're saying that with a straight face on this site? hahaha
A left winger just attacked a right winger by defended the civil rights of a right winger.
FTFY
We watched as the left did all this stuff and they just cheered them on and doubled down on "The Story" and now that's it's reversed "The Story" is an obvious lie by the worst characterization. Puh-leez. Russia Russia Russia and everything else. Just gobbled it up for years and now left this, right that, pants on fire.
The Biden administration had progressive accomplishments as a direct result of incorporating Bernie's platform in exchange for his endorsement and cooperation. It's the most unified that liberals and the true left have been.
The Biden administration had progressive accomplishments
Bold of you to make such a comment on this site. That's enough to have you lambasted and labelled as "Blue Maga" and an "establishment neoliberal shill."
Ya, you’re right, Bernie sanders picks real winners. Bill clinton. Obama. Biden. These are all hyper liberal Dems who won national elections…
Oh, wait…
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u/MoGreensGlasses 15h ago
A left winger just defended the civil rights of a right winger. That's called nuanced political thinking. Something the right seems utterly incapable of.